An elder statesman, Lt.-General Julius Alani Ipoola Akinrinade has had the rare privilege of service to Nigeria at various times. As a youth, he served the nation at the risk of his life as a young officer who fought during the Nigerian-Biafran Civil War. He rose steadily in the military hierarchy to attain the rank of a three star general. He was the nation’s Chief of Army Staff and later the Chief of Defence Staff in the civilian regime of late Alhaji Shehu Shagari.

As a civilian, the Osun State-born retired soldier joined forces with other patriotic Nigerians to protest the annulment of the June 12, 1993 Presidential Election that was presumably won by late Chief Moshood Kashimawo Olawale Abiola.

The agitation soon culminated in the birth of the current Fourth Republic. In this interview with OLAOLU OLADIPO, Akinrinade talked about issues relating to the recently held general elections as well as the opposition raised by his former boss, Chief Olusegun Obasanjo, in the conduct of the poll. Excerpts:

You’ve been quiet for some time considering the fact that you can be regarded as one of those who have worked so hard for the country first as a Civil War hero and later as a pro-democracy campaigner who saw to the enthronement of democratic rule in the country. Why?

I’m not an active or a practicing politician. This is the period of politics. I believe that we must leave the stage for practicing politicians who want to lead us by playing the game. I mean those who want to tell us what they want to do for us when they get into the office.

People like me have no say in the matter (partisan politics). Ours is just to listen and take in whatever they say. The best this period provides for us is the opportunity to ask questions from those aspiring to lead us. We on our part can only give a little piece of advice or discuss what is in our minds. There are avenues for us to do that. For us, we don’t get into the papers or the airwaves just like that.

That suggests that you’ve been contacting those in government from time to time to offer your advice behind the scenes?

No! I don’t have any particular line to the government. I don’t have a direct line to those in government but I have people. I have seniors and friends and all other people that I have known over time who could take my views and ideas to the government.

So, I use them (contacts) from time to time to reach those in government. The Fourth Republic which the country currently operates would be 24 years old this year.

Looking back as someone who took a very active part during the Civil War to keep the country together as well as in the enthronement of this democratic era, looking at the role you played in these events, would you say that what is happening in the country has met your expectations?

No! I’ll be lying if I say that what is currently happening in the country has met my expectations. But it is better late than never. I am happy that we started and gradually things are taking shape, though I dare say that when we take two steps forward one comes back.

That should not discourage us, rather, it should encourage us to keep trying harder and that is what I see all through. We have come a long way, in the last 24 years. There were parts of those years that were wasted on inanities and squabbling and things like that. We wasted a lot of time but then on the whole, we have done very well as a country.

So, I’m not too dejected that we haven’t made too much gain. What worries me is that, even the media tend to compare Nigeria to some other well established nations. How can you compare our progress with that of United Arab Emirates or Singapore? These are different people, different atmosphere, different spaces and very different from what we have here. I think that is not too fair a comparison.

When you compare the task of governing Lagos with them, you will now discover how very intricate and complex it is with us here. Nigeria is a heterogeneous environment; it would always be very difficult to manage. You can see in this last election that people introduced religion as an issue in a bigger way that we have never had before because some charlatans just want to profit from it.

We had a situation where all kinds of characters who called themselves prophets tried to swing things. This could only happen in a country like Nigeria. This kind of thing only exists here in Nigeria. I think on the whole, we survived and we’ve done well. I can only hope that the next government will do much better.

If you are to offer any form of advice, in what area would you like to see improvement in the country’s democratic journey?

All along, there has been a lot of concentration on infrastructure.

Even this government that we are all quick to vilify has done so well in the area of infrastructure, even though many criticize it for exposing the country to so much debt in the process.

This is despite the fact that the country wasn’t making income from oil sales because NNPC was turning in zero income because it was running on deficit. NNPC has been exporting and importing the same product to the country. Unfortunately, half of what they were importing went across the borders. The new government will need all sorts of action to close that gap very ruthlessly.

When the government does that, you will find out that the country doesn’t need to borrow money to provide the essential services to the people. I will urge the new set of people that will now take over to make some harsh decisions and deal with some issues of national importance ruthlessly, not the kind way or methods that we are used to. Whoever feels offended should go if they want to, that is their problem. The very mass of our people, millions of us, will benefit from such actions.

The government will just have to make some harsh decisions and we have to swallow them, after all, we are already swallowing the harsh decision of Naira redesign by the Central Bank of Nigeria. I don’t like that particular decision because it was not well thought out but it is being done.

This is the kind of thing that should happen before we can get out of the current situation that we have found ourselves as a people.

Does that now suggest that you are in support of any move by the incoming government to do away with fuel subsidy, which many people consider as a major issue in the sector?

No!

The first thing I would like the government to do is to make sure that the proposed Dangote Refinery takes off. They must ensure that all the LNG plants become functional.

We hear occasionally from those who work there (LNG) that they are not satisfied with the way and manner it is being managed.

We’ve heard some people who work in the petroleum industry tell us how deep the rot is. We have heard people complaining that when the security agencies arrest any oil vessels, calls usually come through from some characters ordering that the arrested criminals and vehicles be released. This happens when the powers that be or some characters call them (security agencies) to release the trucks and the criminals.

If they close all that, you will discover that Nigeria is indeed a very rich country. I am for effective subsidy removal now; the situation cannot get any harder than that, I mean the situation that we find ourselves in now.

Many people believe that this recently held general election fell below par in terms of the expectations of stakeholders who had hoped for a perfect process, do you agree with those who knocked the poll?

The election has been very credible and I will tell you why. This idea of hacking into the mainframe of INEC’s server was taken with levity by those who tried. That didn’t start today and I am very happy with INEC’s chairman for doing all he could to ensure that he protected the integrity of the process. He knew what was being done and he decided to act accordingly.

INEC didn’t alter anything with regards to the outcome of the poll. Anyone who feels his vote didn’t count should go to the portal now to look at the results and compare it with what was obtained at his polling booth. I think it would be uncharitable for anyone to devalue INEC with regards to this election.

It wasn’t too perfect because no election is very perfect anywhere in the world but I think it is very credible. For instance, the Russians hacked into U.S. elections. If you are looking for a perfect election, you won’t get it but we must keep trying. The reason INEC failed to upload was because people were waiting to hack into the mainframe. I am happy for Mahmood (Yakubu).

I don’t think it would be very charitable for anyone to devalue INEC based on this election. I am not also saying that it was perfect though. I applaud Mahmood for what he has done with this election.

But your position tallies with that of your former boss, Chief Olusegun Obasanjo, who canvassed that all the issues around the election are resolved before the winner is announced. Could you tell us in specific terms, where you differ from him?

Obasanjo is being ingenious.

We have travelled this road before. If I’m to tell you, he was the one who engineered the last one. If he likes, let him take me to court. I will remind him that some people were still alive when trouble started in AD. When we went to bury the father of our late friend, Alhaji Musa Yar’Adua, in Katsina, we flew back, (from Katsina) with him (Obasanjo) after which he went back to Abuja.

We met in a guest house with some people to prepare some papers with the likes of late Chief Anthony Anenih and some other people that I don’t want to name, so as not to embarrass them.

They prepared a document calling for the establishment of an Interim National Government during the heat of the June 12, 1993 Presidential Election. They took it to Ibrahim (Babangida). They were on his (Babangida’s) throat urging him to sign the document to establish the Interim Government. I saw his signature and I saw the comments that he made.

They (Obasanjo and others) now began to state that the elections will not stay.

The question is who are the people that brought the Interim National Government to the country?

Who are those who recruited other people like judges to scuttle the process to pave the way for the establishment of the Interim National Government?

It is unfortunate that we worked for so many years after then before we were able to get our mojo back as a country, now you are back trying to do what you did before.

The same man is not even grateful to God that he is alive and he is working to truncate the will of about 200million people.

No!

This won’t happen. In specific terms, are you accusing Chief Obasanjo of imposing the Ernest Shonekan-led Interim National Government on the country?

It (ING) was the idea of Obasanjo. He even wanted to head it. It was Ibrahim who felt that Obasanjo shouldn’t head it and when his schemes failed, he had to recruit and draft late Chief Shonekan to head the interim government.

He didn’t even allow the late Chief Shonekan to breathe as the leader of the government. That was what happened. He needs to deny this claim before he dies. He should deny my claims before he dies.

Why do you think Obasanjo seems to be against the emergence of any of his Yoruba kin in any electoral contest?

There have been claims that he doesn’t have any form of roots in Yorubaland. If he feels otherwise, he needs to go and take a DNA test to ascertain if he is truly a Yorubaman and if not so, he needs to go back to his kith and kin in other areas.

I don’t think Obasanjo is comfortable with his Yoruba people at all. I’m saying this because each time we have this kind of disaster, he is always at the heart of things, whether it was with late Chief Obafemi Awolowo, or Moshood Abiola and now Bola Tinubu.